Founding pastor of the largest local church in the world, Dr. Paul Yonggi Cho ministers to a congregation of more than 88,000 members (May 1979). Ordained since 1961, Dr. Cho has authored over 20 books, and is in international demand as a speaker.

Dr. Cho's ministry has deeply touched and changed the lives of thousands, challenging them to greater faith in a gracious God. The following interview with Dr. Cho was conducted in the relaxed atmosphere of his office, and is directed at the development and message of this dynamic man of God.

You have an unusually powerful ministry, Dr. Cho. How was it that you first decided to become a minister?

Unlike some people, I did not have a dramatic call from God to enter the ministry. In fact, I neither wanted nor planned to be a preacher. My becoming a minister hinged on one thing: a promise.

Shortly after the Korean War destitution and disease were common in my country. I was a young man then, taking several jobs simply to maintain a livelihood. I was also a devout Buddhist, and felt that man's efforts were sufficient in almost any situation.

Then I grew quite ill. The doctors who examined me said that I had an incurable form of tuberculosis. They sent me home, and said that I would die in four months.

I could hardly believe it, for it seemed so unfair. But as I grew increasingly worse, I realized that the doctors were right. I plead continually with Buddha for healing, but there was no response. I just gave up.

Then a Christian girl started to daily visit my home. I was irritated with her persistence, but later began to call out to God. During this time I made my first commitment to Christ.

It was also during this time that I made a promise to God: I told Him that if He would heal me I would become a minister. In a few months I had totally recovered. Within a few years, I had completed Bible school, and began to pastor a tent church in a slum area of Seoul.

So you see, in a sense I had no choice other than to fulfill my promise. I was drafted into God's army.

How did the tent church contribute to the development of your ministry?

Those were days of struggle. When it rained, we had to place buckets in strategic places to catch the leaks that would trickle through the handsewn tent roof. My congregation was poor, and their lives were empty of everything except their problems.

But with our many problems I came to understand God's power. It was while under that tent roof that God started to develop the miracle ministry of our church. People with all kinds of diseases and problems were healed and helped. I started to see God as a loving Father, who greatly desires to meet His children's needs.

The days in the tent church were also often days of discouragement. There were several times that I packed my bags and was ready to get on a train and leave. At times it seemed that I had exhausted my store of sermon material. I remember spending an entire week studying the Bible from Genesis to Revelation, and coming up with just one sermon.

But more than anything else, I would say that those days at the tent church were times of learning. I found that whenever I come to an end of myself, God would teach me some fundamental lessons on faith.

In the struggles of the tent church, I became aware of the fourth dimension of faith that we as Christians constantly need to develop. I saw the importance of claiming the promises that the Holy Spirit imparts to us. I realized the need to minister to the whole man and woman.
 
 

Can you think of any specific problems that led to further growth in your ministry?

There are two problems I can readily remember.

When the church moved nearer downtown to the West Gate area, we began to grow quite rapidly. Having acquired traditional concepts in Bible school, I felt that I as pastor was responsible for doing everything. This responsibility ranged from marrying to burying, from preaching to home visitation, from counseling to baptizing. One Sunday night in 1964, the exhaustion of months of continual activity overtook me. While interpreting for a visiting American evangelist, I collapsed on the platform.

In the months of recuperation that followed, God spoke to my hearth through the example of Moses in Exodus 18. I realized that like Moses, I should delegate my ministry and authority to lay leaders.

My problem occurred when I shared this with the deacons and deaconesses of my church. They not only felt incapable, but accused me of neglecting my rightful job. But as time went on they came to realize how important it was that they give special attention and ministry to those entrusted to their care.

Those deacons and deaconesses are now among the lay leaders heading weekly meetings in more than 5,000 neighborhood home cell units, scattered over the entire city of Seoul. What began as a conflict of concepts in 1964 has developed into a vast, efficient network of membership care.

But my greater problem was the financial load of building our large church on Yoido Island. To erect that building I needed two and a half million dollars. Three pressure of having to raise such a large amount sometimes pushed my thoughts to suicide.

One morning while I was asking God how He was going to supply the needed funds, God told me to give a seed offering of faith. He told me to sell the house my wife greatly cherished, and give the money to the building fund. Though it did seem foolish, we sold our home, and moved into a small apartment. Many of the church members later followed a similar pattern. Through the sacrificial giving of our membership, we were able to raise the entire amount.

And look how God has honored His promise. That same structure now houses services for a membership of over 88,000.

I think that our church has grown the way it has because we have implemented biblical growth principles. The foremost principle is crucial: to recognize the sovereignty of the Holy Spirit. Christians frequently limit God by their narrow preconceptions, then wonder why God's power seems to be so weak in their lives.

Secondly, it is important to direct ministry at meeting people's needs. This is a principle that became evident in the tent church. It is not effective to tell a sick person that God loves him, unless you also release God's healing power to bring him health. Our church has gained a reputation of being a place where needs are met.

Recognition of God-appointed leadership is one of the main keys in developing a need-meeting church. We stress unity within our church body. The members of my church submit to me as their pastor.

As their leader, I am responsible to God for the way I guide them. And in leading my congregation, I must also serve them, and show them how to serve others.

To assist me in this task there is a pastoral staff of 118, who also help coordinate the home cell unit system. Even though our church is large, we have made provisions for personal attention, and ample opportunity for membership involvement.

People stay in a church which not only meets their needs, but also makes them feel needed. Our church has been unafraid to organize and integrate this laity involvement, an organization seen clearest in our home cell unit system. Good organization properly channels the tremendous source of power that we have in Christ, power often wasted unless rightly used.

Finally, let me point out the vital necessity of preaching the full Gospel Message. God made man a creature to be filled with positive faith, not negative fear. The members of our church have faith in a good God who desires to bless them. Because of this, they want to witness about Christ, and share their personal testimonies. It is also their belief in God's faithfulness that prompts the members of our church to pray.
 
 

One of the main topics of your ministry is faith. Why do you think that faith is important to the Christian life?

Knowledge of Jesus and God's Word forms the basis for a commitment to Christ. But it is with faith that we begin our Christian life.

Faith is the avenue that we use to touch God. The Bible points out the importance of faith, telling us that without faith we cannot please God.

Secondly, it is through faith that we develop our Christian life. A genuine depth in faith leads to a deeper walk with Christ.

Thirdly, it is only through faith that we can receive miracles. There are many needs in this world of ours. Through faith we can release God's power to meet those needs.
 
 

Dr. Cho, what is your main goal or desire as a minister?

I have a burning desire to see people successful in all areas of their lives. This is why I continue to be a minister. This is why I have launched out into ministries like Church Growth International, which encourages pastors to be successful.
 
 

What does this success include?

Success for the whole person first includes genuine salvation of one's spirit. With this salvation a person has eternal life in Christ.

True success also involves the intellectual and mental aspect of man. We in the religious world have tended to overlook the Spirit-led development and renewal of man's mind. But it is vital to a successful Christian life.

I also want people to experience success in the physical and material realm. There are many members in my church who were once poor, but still gave to God. God now has given back to them. Some of those same people are now millionaires.

God is ultimately successful in all that He does. If we are truly God's followers, we cannot help but to also be successful. So we need to study the Bible, and follow the teaching in the Word of God.
 
 

Why is it then that some Christians flourish, while others seem in a continual state of failure?

The Christian's success or failure is almost always dependent on his attitudes. We must have the proper positive attitudes toward God, toward faith, toward others, and toward ourselves.

A negative spirit enjoys the negative. A negative attitude is like a magnet for failure. Think of a sailboat on a lake during a windy day. The way its sails are placed determine its direction. So it is with us. Our attitudes are like those sails, determining the directions that our lives will take.

But to change from a negative framework to a positive one is an extremely difficult task for man. This is one reason why we need Christ's life changing power.
 
 

When you were a young pastor struggling in the tent church, many would have thought that you were destined for failure. Based on your experience in ministry, is there any advice you can give to those wanting greater success in their lives?

The first basis to success is peace with God, a place of rest in Christ where one turns fears and worries over to God. This does not come with salvation alone. It also involves an attitude of forgiveness, continual confession of guilt, and determination to be obedient to God's Will.

Positive visualization also plays an important role in changing one's attitudes. The Bible says that "where there is no vision, the people perish." One must go down in the recesses of his heart and mind, and envision Christ-centered success.

When I was a young man in Bible school, I envisioned building the largest church in Korean church history. People paid little attention to my dream then. But that dream burned in my soul for years. Now look what God has done with that mental picture. Not only is the church I pastor the largest in Korean history, but some are even claiming it to be the largest local church in global church history.

So if you are sick or have a problem, do not dwell on thoughts of illness or defeat. Pick up the brush of your imagination, paint vivid pictures of yourself completely well and whole, your problems solved. Meditate on these images in the spiritual realm. The tremendous power you will release by doing this actually shapes the course of your future.

God created the universe with His spoken word. We must therefore be careful not to use our daily language promiscuously. Our spoken words are a crucial key to our self-images, and need to be positive, emitting success. When people ask how you are, say "Wonderful!" When they ask how life is, reply "Great!"

Finally, to live a successful life, you must learn how to give success to others. It is a serious problem when a person desires only to receive.

I have learned this principle as a minister. When I have helped to create a positive attitude of success within those of my congregation, success has been heaped back on me. Those who give success, receive success.

We Christians need to be successful. We need to be shining testimonies to the world around us, We need not only fulfill our promises to God, but share the ultimate promise with others: our Lord Jesus Christ.

Article copyrighted 1979 by "World of Faith" magazine, Summer 1979, Volume 1, No. 2, Pages 18-14. This magazine is no longer published, but has been replaced by "Church Growth," available at P. O. Box 7; Seoul 150, Korea.